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Is this issue important to you? Votes: 11

by Hornsby Council 2:47pm, 11 March 2009 You will need to login or sign up to do that

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MSH Comment 1

10:13am, 18 March 2009

This Housing Strategy is a 10-year plan...

Where is the plan to increase local employment?

Showing 1 reply

bellinid Comment 1.1

8:46am, 26 March 2009

Council has mentioned that they want to get office development happening along George St. They said that this is crucial to attracting spending in the retail area.

I think they should also be looking at the range of shops that Hornsby CBD currently provides. They should be trying to attract more people from the upper north shore ie Wahroonga down because these areas are quite wealthy. for many reasons, one of them being a limited choice in better quality apparel many of them prefer going to Chatswood or even Castle Hill where there is more on offer.

Lizo Comment 2

2:51pm, 20 March 2009

If the rezoning goes through, the council has said that all the properties affected will now have higher land values because they are able to be redeveloped for more housing so they will also be subjected to higher rates (and much higher rates since the majority of properties are going to be rezoned to 5 storey developments). Owners can apply to not pay if they cannot afford the higher rates but, if they sell their house, the value of the postponed rates is payable to the council as part of the property transacation.

This is a very sneaky way of increasing rates and the council profiting from the rezoning. It also increases the likelihood that property owners in the rezoned areas will have to sell and quickly (even if they want to stay) because they cannot afford the increased rates on their properties. So, in effect, despite the council saying that no-one is going to be forced to sell their properties, the council is introducing measures that will mean that some owners will be forced because they cannot afford to stay. It also makes it far less attractive for normal buyers to want to buy those properties when they can go to the next street or across the road and buy a house with much lower rates, again giving an unfair advantage to developers as there will be even less competition to buy the properties, so the developers will be able to get them at a cheaper price. I really think that this is an unfair policy and should be challenged.

Showing 1 reply

RichardB43 Comment 2.1

5:05pm, 28 March 2009

The land is worth more becuase developers will now compete for it. So if you decide to move you will get a neat profit!

If you decide to stay a few years, you won't have to pay a cent more in rates. Just defer the lot. Then when you sell in a few years you will still make a profit, and just pay off the deferred rates out of the profit.

The rates will be higher on these properties, becuase there will be alot more people lving on them. Which will keep the rates relatively lower for the rest of us!

Hey, every cloud is black if you wear black tinted glasses.

Showing 2 replies

davidmcf Comment 2.1.1

4:54pm, 3 April 2009

Richard, you say "that rates will be higher, because there will be more people living there". That is patently not true *until* after the property is developed. Any increase in rates should not affect the current owners, but be paid once a property is sold. Current owners should not carry the burden of excess rates when their property (in affect) hasn't changed at all.

Will I survive the next bushfire? Comment 2.1.2

12:01am, 1 May 2009

What if, in this depression, no developer is interested in buying your land. You'll then be stuck with the higher rates.

Showing 1 reply

bellinid Comment 2.1.2.1

9:48am, 1 May 2009

And not being able to sell if you wanted to. And if you did you would get nothing for your house.

Remember that some people may want to sell because they are moving to another area, are getting divorced, are bankrupt, it is a deceased estate. The usual things that make up life and have nothing to do with rezoning.

bellinid Comment 3

9:38pm, 26 March 2009

It is not only as ratepayers that people need to stand up but also as voters in State and Federal seats. NSW needs to spend serious money in Sydney on infrastructure such as rail and metro but the government always pulls out of committing itself to anything. This is why they have dumped the issue of providing extra housing onto local government. local government often compounds the problem by being b-grade and mediocre in their decision making. Hence we get Strategies like this one. Local government then tries to get out of being responsible for any of it by saying that its the State government's fault.

Another thing that everyone should be aware of is that there is the very real possibilty of the main northern railway line being quadrupled to allow for a constant stream of goods trains to go screeching and rumbling past probably 24 hours a day and also to allow more interurban trains to go through. This too is going to have a disastrous effect on quality of life in the area with no benefit to local residents like more trains and faster trains.

So less trees, more noise, more stress, more pollution. Even here there is the possibility to properly plan a whole new line which does not devastate a lovely green area of Sydney. But the chance of it occurring is less than the chance of winning first division lotto not once but twice.

Seriously, in many ways this is truly a pathetic country. There are poorer countries that invest a lot more in infrastructure.

Revitalising Thornleigh is not a bad idea in itself. The Pennant Hills RD section must be one of the ugliest in sydney. Saying no to everything is not the way either. If we said no to an opera house as some people did and this was acted upon, then the opera house would not be standing today and that would have been a very sad thing. But what is needed is proper, appropriate, considered and well designed development. This is where good architects and urban designers are worth a thousand times the fees they are paid when there is a good outcome. But Australia as a society generally fails to appreciate designers.

We do deserve better.

Showing 1 reply

RichardB43 Comment 3.1

5:01pm, 28 March 2009

The State government has just invested a fortune in putting the new rail line through Macquarie and Ryde. Giving us additional services from Hornsby. Or hadn't you noticed!

Why object to freight trains going 24 hours a day. At present thety are all restricted to going through in the night. Isn't it better to spread the traffic over the 24 hours.

Showing 2 replies

bellinid Comment 3.1.1

9:11pm, 28 March 2009

The train service to the city is actually going to be slower to all stations apart from Wynyard which will be one minute faster. If you compare these times with the timetable we had before the current one ie the go slow so as to be on time one, then the service is abysmally worse.

As for freight trains you obviously live nowhere near where they travel. They are unhealthily and stress inducingly noisy and also polluting, all this over a wide area, not just metres from the track. If the track gets quadrupled then it wil become even more invasive in its effects. also the quadruplication of the track mentions only increases in freight movements and central coast/Newcastle services. Nothing about improving the metropolitan services. We need a new freight line that circles the city elsewhere where the grade is gentler.

As for your knowledge of when freight trains run, they are not just restricted to going through at night. They go trhough during the day and evening too. The only times they restrict them is during the morning and afternoon peak periods.

Showing 1 reply

RichardB43 Comment 3.1.1.1

9:40pm, 29 March 2009

Life is about choosing between the leasser of two evils.

Give me a few more freight trains a day, rather than a few thousand extra trucks a day. Give me more freight trains during the day, when noise doesn't travel anywhere nearly as much as it does in the evening and night. (Maybe I didn't realise that some freight trains go through duing the day, just because I don't hear them, whereas I do hear the night ones)

As to asking them to build a whole new freight line. Sorry, Don Quixote isn't around to help you with that one.

I looked at the draft timetable a few months ago. Services to St Leonards, North Sydney, Wynyard were all quite a bit quicker. Not to mention the new stations of the Macquarie Uni / Ryde area. New rolling stock. And a lot more services. Not to mention all th eimproved stations. Guess we might need to compare timetables. but, please don't say they don't spend on infrastructure. That just isn't true.

Showing 1 reply

bellinid Comment 3.1.1.1.1

10:53am, 30 March 2009

They certainly don't spend nowhere near enough on infrastructure. And it is a bit depressing to reduce life to just being the choice between the lesser of two evils.

As for the timetable. I said getting to the city, NOT St Leonards or North Sydney. If you look at the timetable you will see that it will be 1 (one) minute faster to get to Wynyard, slower to Town Hall, Central and Redfern. Hence for the majority of stations IT WILL BE SLOWER. Not to mention how much longer it is going to take to get to any station between Epping and Central as a result of having to change trains. But why should I complain? I and many others have always wanted a faster service to stations such as Wolltonecraft and Waverton, rather than somewhere unimportant like Central!

The Epping/Chatswood link would have been much more successful if it had been built according to its original design intent ie as a continuous rail link between Parramatta and Chatswood. There is no new rolling stock on the new line because they stuffed up the design, so they have to use old carriages. Sydney has been waiting for new rolling stock for decades. We get it in tiny dribbles.

Don Quixote has nothing to do with the appropriateness of a vision for a new freight line, and passenger lines for that matter. And guess what? This just reinforces my statement that not enough is being spent on proper infrastructure!

And it also starkly highlights the fact that there is no vision underpinning any planning and related infrastructure decisions.

davidmcf Comment 3.1.2

5:01pm, 3 April 2009

The problem with this upgrade is that it doesn't go far enough. They are attempting to hugely increase the population north of Hornsby without any attempt to increase train services. In any case, adding an extra platform at Hornsby isn't going to speed up trains on the north shore line, which during peak are running at capacity.

RichardB43 Comment 4

5:12pm, 28 March 2009

In the past I've lived in an ordinary house overlooked by a 5 storey apartment block, on the north side. And overall, it was never a problem. People just rarely came out of the block to the rear

But ask me to live across the road from a unit block ENTRANCE and I'd have a very different opinion. All the extra coming and going, people and cars, would be very intrusive.

So my view is that one serious error in the plan is to put units onto one side of Lords Ave. It would be better to take over both sides of Lords Ave, and the space of Lords Ave itself. And just ensure enough buffer space between the rear of any development and the properties on Wall St/Bouvardia Ave. Perhaops make that "rear" section lower rise.

RichardB43 Comment 5

5:16pm, 28 March 2009

IT IS IMPERATIVE ASQUTIH SHOPS ARE THE FIRST AREA TO BE REDEVELOPED.

Asquith shops are a disgrace anyway. This is a great opportunity to get them redeveloped with some quality development. Mixed shopping/commercial and high rise, with very tight controls on the quality of teh development.

If other units go up before the shops are redeveloped, the chances of getting any quality development and attracting a better standard of newcomer will be severely impacted. Asquith will stand a great chance of becoming a high rise slum area in very quick time.

ASQUITH SHOPS must be redeveloped first, not later.

Showing 3 replies

suzanne Comment 5.1

9:09pm, 30 March 2009

Yes, the Asquith shopping centre is an absolute disgrace.

Does Coles know something that we commoners don't? Massive expansion to their store PLUS undeground parking? They are obviously expecting a large increase in business - why?

lozza Comment 5.2

7:03pm, 5 April 2009

congrats the 1st decent comment from you I have read

AJS2 Comment 5.3

9:16pm, 22 April 2009

Again, having the shops redeveloped is of little consolation if your house will look over a five storey development.

Of course, the shopping strip could do with renovating but extensively redeveloped shops will only be used to justify further development.

RichardB43 Comment 6

5:19pm, 28 March 2009

WHERE ARE THE EXTRA PARKS IN THE PLAN FOR ASQUITH ?

2,00o odd people coming in, and not a single plan for any extra park space ?

Par for the course for a council that has not added a single bit of useable park or community space throughout the development of Waitara!

Showing 2 replies

suzanne Comment 6.1

9:14pm, 30 March 2009

The whole housing plan is just money-making. Wasn't medium-density housing originally put forward as "affordable housing"? Affordable to who? Now we will have more and more units and townhouses with no extra facilities to support this expansion For instance, parking. Parking at Asquith Railway Station has always been at a premium, but no with the townhouses in Haldane and Heath Streets, all street-parking is taken by residents who don't want to use their undeground parking facilities. IMO the whole thing is short-sighted and a money-making grab.

davidmcf Comment 6.2

4:23pm, 16 April 2009

Open Space is just the start of the issues though. Where are the upgrade plans for roads, rail, power, water, sewerage? It seems to me this is a barely thought out plan to dump more houses, without any increase in the infrastructure required.

Showing 1 reply

lozza Comment 6.2.1

7:39pm, 16 April 2009

So true david, train sevices onthe local timetable is 1/2 hr.roads carrying commuters to work the mum taking kids to skool trucks from the north delivering to Hornsby shopping precint,so on & so on. All the various sevices & inferstructures NEED to be addressed first before housing!!

RichardB43 Comment 7

7:21pm, 28 March 2009

AT COMMUNITY MEETINGS, will we be given a chance of making any sort of presentation ?

How often do we go to a meeting where some "official" makes a big presentation with the aid of Powerpoint on Digital Projector, but anyone else is lucky to even get a chance to use a microphone.

What facilities are going to be available to people to be able to show alternative plans, visual information ?

Showing 1 reply

bellinid Comment 7.1

9:14pm, 28 March 2009

From experience council doesn't want us to speak.

Showing 1 reply

RichardB43 Comment 7.1.1

9:48pm, 29 March 2009

Now that is something we perhaps should work on togther.

An invite for bellinid alone. Drop me an email at rb_be##inid@*hebou#*s.ne* - replace the * signs with the 6th letter in Asquith. Replace the # signs with the letter that should be obvious to you.

RichardB43 Comment 8

9:50pm, 29 March 2009

This foum is diffenrt from most online forums.

It has no provision for people to get in touch privately.

Now, if I wasa cynical type, I'd guess that might actually be a choice of a council that wants to keep control of the debate.

So perhaps we should set up another forum too for us to get in touch. Any ideas.

AJS2 Comment 9

9:11pm, 22 April 2009

I think the council should do the following

a) Start acting in the interests of the residents of Hornsby Shire (remeber those taxes and rates come from somewhere)

Failing that

b) All councillors and mayor should resign forcing a new round of elections.

and/or

c) A suburb by suburb referendum to gauge the true feelings of the residents regarding the proposed redevelopment.

davidmcf Comment 10

4:38pm, 26 April 2009

Council should say to the state government that they will consider rezoning once they put the required infrastructure in place. It is not the council's problem to upgrade the train line, water, sewerage, electricity etc., but it is certainly a very good reason to put any rezoning on hold.

bellinid Comment 11

8:12am, 11 May 2009

Page 2 of today's (11/05/09) SMH - PLANNING COUP FOR DEVELOPERS. Dept of Planning has been overhauled so that senior staff who were not sympathetic enough to developers have been given the boot, thus paving the way for developers to maraud Sydney like visigoths.

Check it out!

Cat Comment 12

2:59pm, 15 May 2009

Every level of government is looking after itself on the Tax/Rate payer's expense. Sydney is growing out of control an will continue to grow. Too many levels of government in Australia to satisfy.

In the end progress will prevail.

Showing 1 reply

lozza Comment 12.1

5:47pm, 15 May 2009

I agree that there are many levels of gov't BUT smaller may result in people deciding the best for OUR lifestyle & NOT lived or seen the areas involved is a worry. But IF & ONLY IF WE (you,me & every animal) stands up fights as ONE we can slow un-welcome progress & have unifide & benificial solution to this housing issue. If we put them there we can put them out!!! John Farnam "TURN THE PRESSURE UP"

Showing 1 reply

Cat Comment 12.1.1

3:41pm, 18 May 2009

HAHA

redsmart Comment 13

6:42pm, 16 May 2009

Our former N.S.W Regional Director Planning Northern Metropolitan Sydney Area -our area- (now retired & living in multi story high-rise in Sydney), commented this week about the proposed 5-story high-rise in Asquith - Mt.Colah - Mt. Kurung-gai - Berowra.

"AN OUTRAGEOUS PROPOSAL"

"TOTALLY ALIEN TO THE AREA"

"ABSOLUTELY RIDICULOUS"

"LACKS COMMON SENSE"

"TOTALLY STUPID JOKE"

"THIS IS NOT BARCELONA, MADRID OR LONDON"

"IF IT HAPPENED IN ANY OTHER COUNTRY, THERE WOULD BE RIOTS"

"Hornsby Council, (unlike Kuring-gai Council, which refused to listen) has previously undertaken good sensible planning for its shire. This new scatter-gun approach, 'one size fits all', is ridiculous"

When a top town planner with 25 years experience in the N.S.W planning department said this - as well as the vast majority of residents- it is time for Hornsby Council to STOP TRYING TO FORCE 5-STORY HIGH-RISE DOWN OUR THROATS & come up with a revised plan that develops our village communities instead of trying to reduce them to the lowest common denominator.

Showing 1 reply

Cat Comment 13.1

9:31am, 18 May 2009

We need him/her to come out of retirement and knock some sense into the State Government!

A sad site indeed whenever I drive past those ugly medium rise units at the end of Burns Rd St. Ives

Dennis Tamini Comment 14

4:51pm, 27 May 2009

NO LEGITIMACY—NO CONSTITUTION—NO HEAD OF POWER

The following are based not on assumptions but “officially” admitted FACTS.

The Australian Constitution DOES NOT recognise ‘local government’

Attempts by the “government” to alter the constitution to recognize ‘local government’ have failed TWICE. The last Referendum was held on the 3rd of September 1988. 67% of the population REJECTED the proposal for recognition of a third tier of “government”, namely, local “councils”.

The result of any Referendum is LAW. Despite that clear unmistakable affirmation of the Constitution by the people of Australia IN ALL STATES, the “government” (Hawke) introduced the ‘Local Government Act 1989” (1993 in some states)

All the bureaucrats, in every “council”, are relying on this ULTRA VIRES, NULL and VOID Act to justify their UNLAWFUL actions.

The “council” has no power over your property unless you consent! The concentration of power comes from a vacuum. The Constitutional power you have that you decide to ignore does not go away. It accumulates to whomever wishes to have it via the issuance of ignored/ uncontested/ lost claims. Remember all the Council Notices in your local rag that you don’t read? How many times have you had someone speak on your behalf about what they say you decided? They can only do so with your consent in law therefore what they say and do with that consent compels you to their will even though it is against your conscience to do so. Many times they use bluff to compel you.

The remedy at hand is to ask them in a notice to provide their origin of power to direct you in anything.

"He who does not repel a wrong when he can, occasions it."

"He who fails to assert his rights has none."

"He who does not deny, admits."

The Constitution of Australia requires that State Government attends to it’s infrastructure. It gets the resources to do this from the Federal Government as it is unable to tax by law. As “councils” are not government they are relegated in operation into a state of being, not unlike that of, a sub contractor to the State Government in providing services for which they receive state monies. As they are not government, and need to be somehow legally recognized in law, they are set up as businesses e.g. CITY OF NOWHERE ( abn 345 345 345). As a business they can operate within business guidelines. They CHARGE you for services that the Constitution has already legally required the State Governments to provide you without taxes. When you use those services you are required to pay for them as they are NOT government services. Just as you have a right to choose to pay for a private hospital rather than use the free public hospital you can also “choose” to use a private business to provide your local infrastructure. You consent and choose the private business to undertake your local requirements by accepting and paying the demand on the rates notice or by ignoring it. (Remember, "He who does not deny, admits.") Just by phoning your local “council” and speaking to someone about this or that you have accepted their “authority”. You have consented to do business with them. Remember querying the bill from your solicitor about paying for a phone call to ask him/her whether they got your fax etc? Recognition of authority is “deemed” to be consent.

Should a local council business (“your council”) become insolvent you have consented to individually meet the financial shortfall.(The buy back of the Quarry) You have consented to this by not informing this local council business that this is not the case. If the local corner shop goes broke do you consent to pay all of it’s bills also?

If you have a local matter then take it to the State Government Local Government Minister’s office and if that reaps no help approach your local State Member to get it done. That is what the Constitution requires you to do as a loyal Australian.

If you do nothing with this information you have “consented” to give your right to act on your behalf on these matters to others. It is also your right to do this. All power in Australia rests in the hands of individual Australians and when used this power can rewrite the Constitution and direct the highest court of the land to your bidding!!!!

THE POWER TO CHANGE THIS COUNTRY IS IN YOUR HANDS

Showing 1 reply

MichaelO Comment 14.1

8:19pm, 27 May 2009

And this is relevant how exactly?

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RichardB43 Comment 14.1.1

1:52am, 28 May 2009

Well, its relevant to Dennis, obviously.

But for the rest of us perhaps it would be more constructive if we stuck with trying to seek solutions based on the existing realities, not Dennis' pipe dreams.

RichardB43 Comment 15

1:53am, 28 May 2009

I have put a number of submissions to the council.

I share these with people for discussion, on a Wiki website www.hornsby.wetpaint.com. On this wiki website, if you join up, you can add your own pages and discussion too.

You don’t need to join up to view.

Look forward to your comments and contributions.

Richard Boult

RB1 - Asquith Shopping Centre – Council can and must be Pro-Active

http://hornsby.wetpaint.com/page/RB1+-+Asquith+Shopping+Centre+%E2%80%93+Council+can+and+must+be+Pro-Active

RB2 - Suggested traffic control for junction of Amor St, Pacific Hwy, bridge ramp north

http://hornsby.wetpaint.com/page/RB2+-+Suggested+traffic+control+for+junction+of+Amor+St%2C+Pacific+Hwy%2C+bridge+ramp+north

RB3 - Amelioration of increased Valuation and Rates problem.

http://hornsby.wetpaint.com/page/RB3+-+Amelioration+of+increased+Valuation+and+Rates+problem.

RB4 - Draft 5 Storey Guidelines - Comments & Suggestions

http://hornsby.wetpaint.com/page/RB4+-+Draft+5+Storey+Guidelines+-+Comments+%26+Suggestions

RB5 - Amelioration of Impact for some Asquith precincts