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Content of the Agreement
Does the relationship agreement say what you want it to say or is there something else that should be included (or omitted)?
The relationship agreement is a high-level document setting out a vision and principles for how communities and government can work together. It is intended to be used as a guide for building community-government relationships, rather than to be legally binding. The four draft principles are:
- Our work together shall be built on trust and mutual respect.
- We will act in good faith.
- We have a collective responsibility to hear and respond to the voices of all.
- We will recognise and respect Te Tiriti o Waitangi.
You can read the full wording of the draft Agreement and gain a fuller picture in the Consultation Overview.
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Relates to
document:
Draft Agreement - Text version (1 page) (33.5 KB)
Comment 1 15 Jul 2010, 7:27 PM
Calling it an Agreement makes it sound like it could have legal implications. You say it is an aspirational document so what about calling it a 'Relationship Charter'?
Comment 1.1 12 Aug 2010, 3:41 AM
I agree
Comment 2 16 Jul 2010, 4:58 PM
Why say "communities of Aotearoa New Zealand" and the "government of New Zealand"? Is Aotearoa New Zealand different to New Zealand?? It is confusing (and overly wordy).
Comment 3 20 Jul 2010, 7:43 PM
Don't use the word Compact like they have in the UK & Australia as I don't think that term is very well known by most people.
Comment 4 21 Jul 2010, 8:24 AM
These principles are a given for any meaningful engagement and it is a bit sad they have to be written down. Agencies claim they are doing all the right things. They will point to their 'consultative' efforts as evidence of good faith. If you were to review feedback over a period of years you will find the same issues identified repeatedly. Maybe it is more important to agree on measures/indicators? The relationship will come together when the parties are equally accountable for the result.
Comment 5 21 Jul 2010, 1:17 PM
What seems to be lost in this entire thing, is the history of this document. Originally it was the Statement of Government Intentions which was a document stating the relationship between government and the Tangata Whenua, Community and Voluntary Sector.
This original document had no teeth, was only signed by government and was rarely adhered to by government EO's or departments.
Since 2001 a lot of work has been done in the 3rd sector to ask for accountability and teeth to be added to this document.
with this new 'lovely' agreement, with the sentiments no reasonable human being could ever NOT agree to, all the work since 2001 has been lost, and in fact the relationship between the 3rd sector and government will be taken back to before 2001 to a nastier and less inclusive time, which seems to me to be antithesis of what seems to be intended.
Comment 5.1 25 Jul 2010, 3:31 PM
It surprises me that a group set up by a Minister who is Maori appears to have completely ignored the history of the sector, and why a relationship agreement was sought in the first place. Your draft agreement says "we acknowledge the past" but clearly the steering group has not understood the issues that need addressing. We cannot move forward if key issues are not addressed.
Comment 5.1.1 30 Jul 2010, 10:46 AM
Having newly come to this debate, I am bewildered by not knowing the background and the reason why all this palaver is seen as necessary. I am a member of several voluntary groups and this business has passed us by because the invitation to the huis said nothing that made any sense at all to us. It smacks unpleasantly of various ingroups pretending to represent the communities, which by and large, are completely in the dark about what is being said and arranged in their names. There was a local similar thing arranged by the DHB for users of mental health services couched in very similar language, which had to be cancelled because noone wanted to go. The person organising this was mystified when I emailed her to say- "what is it all about?" and "no wonder no-one showed any interest". Once she had got over my blunt speaking we were able to sort out the problem and what she really meant in terms of everyday speak... she gets PAID to deliver these services and has no idea of how to speak to people so that they understand her!!!
Comment 6 22 Jul 2010, 1:36 PM
I think that the use of the term 'we will be responsive to each others gudiance' is signing up both the community sector and government to a lot. NGOs need to remain independent of government and sometimes government has to take the lead and make hard decisions (how about - "we will consider each other's perspectives and advice").
Likewise "we will be generous" how does a funding agency demonstrate being generous if it doesn't have enough money to go to every applicant??
Comment 7 23 Jul 2010, 3:56 PM
With Te Tiriti o Waitangi being a principle or guiding agreement, that all Groups receiving Govt funding be contractually required to have an MOU, or hapu/iww mandate (depending on local Iwi requirement) to receive Govt monies.
This will include a mutual development plan, that emphasises hapu development away from handouts, "helping" agencies etc.
All contracts must be reported back under these criteria by provider and Maori "partner"...
This will foster connection with the whenua, history, tangata whenua, as well as Unity and mutual development of all people.
Comment 8 24 Jul 2010, 9:07 AM
I've read the history, considered the wording of the Draft Agreement, had a look at Compact arrangements in the UK and Australia (and found them wanting), and attended a consultation meeting. But nowhere have I found an answer to my question "Why Do We Need An Agreement?" And if the need is justified, Why is there no similar agreement / arrangement with the Private Sector? And Why should I sign a commitment to principles which are part of my daily practice anyway? Some enlightenment, please.
Comment 8.1 24 Jul 2010, 10:40 AM
Frankly I find all this legalistic and bureaucratic jargon absolutely mystifying. It sounds wonderful, but could someone please say what it actually means for people who don't command such high falutin language? I looked all over the place for some clues and finally discovered it seems to be something about charitable and voluntary organisations but, come on, people, justify your big salaries and COMMUNICATE!!!
Comment 8.1.1 25 Jul 2010, 1:25 PM
Please Hecate, keep on nagging, because I don't think we have been shown the full picture. UK has a Compact (aka an 'agreement'), and then the new Conservative coalition government talks up the Big Society as the new policy - you know, the greatest thing since sliced bread which is nothing more than a recycling of old, and tired ideas. Go have a look at http://www.i-volunteer.org.uk/newshound/government-reveals-plans-for-big-society/ to find out more.
Comment 9 26 Jul 2010, 2:21 PM
Additional discussion is also appearing online in response to an item from the NZ Federation of Voluntary Welfare Organisations. You can see these comments at http://www.nzfvwo.org.nz/featured/draft-relationship-agreement-with-government-feels-hollow/
Please share your thoughts here or there after reading what others have to say.
Comment 9.1 28 Jul 2010, 3:20 PM
I had a look at the indicated page, Grant, and, frankly, I still don't know what this is all about. Can you people please use plain language for benighted people like me? (by the way I have a B.A. and a post-graduate Diploma in Social Work, but I have never learned this lingo, it does nothing for me and I feel it indicates a gross inability to communicate in a way that ordinary human beings will understand.I find this jargon really offensive and ugly. We have enough words in our great English language to be able to talk about whatever you are talking about without sounding like a lot of hollow heads. I expect much better of people who are being paid to promulgate these policies and ideas but speak a secret language and cut out others who would like to be able to comment.
Comment 9.1.1 29 Jul 2010, 7:38 AM
Sorry that you are having difficulty understanding the information. The contributions at the page I indicated above link were actually written by a variety of people from community organisations.
Perhaps a couple of documents in the library at http://bangthetable.com/document/index/227 may assist. One is 'Kia Tutahi graphic version', which shows the key points in an illustrated form. The other is the 'presentation summary PDF - English' in the 'Summaries in various languages' folder. Hope that helps.
Comment 9.1.1.1 30 Jul 2010, 10:52 AM
Yes I DO have trouble understanding the information. I don't know the background to this plan and why is something being fixed if it wasn't broke in the first place? The language most of you are using is NOT easily understood by some of us who process information in a different way- not lack of IQ but differently wired- and certainly, if I talked to my very intelligent friends I know they would be mystified too.
Sorry you have difficulty understanding this revolutionary information!
BUT you are PAID to communicate with people like me and the great general public- please can all you folk involved in this issue take notice and do some translation- some examples of the issues you all seem to know about (but I/we don't) would be extremely helpful as well, thank you.
Comment 9.1.1.1.1 11 Aug 2010, 11:24 AM
Personally, I find the language you use Hecate hard to understand. (Capitals and all)
I totally understand what is being written, and I think that most parties are clear and concise about the issues.
If you do not understand the background, take the iniative and research it, although I believe it is well articulated.
Get off your high horse Hecate, and focus on the issues around this agreement.
Comment 9.1.1.1.1.1 11 Aug 2010, 10:16 PM
Fine, you understand totally. You "get" the pompous bureaucratic language and no doubt speak it fluently. Not everyone does and I am speaking for those whose brains do not cope with this jargon-riddled and bewildering style.Having come newly to this subject and feeling I should be able to understand and take part in the debate, I am floundering in a morass of words with seemingly little substance.
This is the "issue" for me- apparently this is an important subject which the "community" should be engaged in, but I suspect that there are many people not at all engaged because they can't understand what it is all about. I did go to the sites Grant recommended and got very little joy from them because they use the same language.
Comment 9.1.1.1.1.1.1 12 Aug 2010, 8:15 AM
To help Hecate, here is my understanding of what this is all about.
*In 2001 the Government of the time produced a document called The Statement of Government Intentions which outlined principles of how government should work with the non-profit sector.
This was necessary because as in many cases the non-profit sector was being funded by government to provide services. eg: Budget Advice Services.
The government had the money...the ngo sector did not, so therefore = power imbalance and often unfair practices.
Funding cuts without warning; changes to contracts;and other things without consultation and warning.
Are you understanding so far Hecate?
*The new document more…
Comment 10 4 Aug 2010, 6:50 AM
Content of the draft Agreement
The draft Relationship Agreement is very high level – as promised – but it’s actually less strong and less clear than the previous Statement of Government Intentions for an Improved Community-Government Relationship (the SOGI). We would like a document that spells out the respective roles and responsibilities of parties, and has considerably more substance than this draft.
Comment 10.1 4 Aug 2010, 7:47 AM
For anyone unfamiliar with the Statement of Government Intentions for an Improved Community-Government Relationship - you can read a copy at http://www.ocvs.govt.nz/about-us/statement-of-govt-intentions/
Comment 11 8 Aug 2010, 4:31 PM
The Community Sector Taskforce has prepared a contribution to this process out of concern for some key aspects of the history of our Sector that need acknowledgement as we move forward.
The Taskforce has prepared a statement that, as Tangata Whenua and Tangata Tiriti members of the Taskforce, we believe acknowledges the history and uniqueness of our
Sector’s presence and contribution in Aotearoa. The statement can be viewed on our website at http://www.cst.org.nz/about/sector-government_relationship_agreement/.
We would welcome comments on this statement.
If you wish to support this statement, just send your name, organisation name and contact details to Iris Pahau, our National Development Manager at awe@paradise.net.nz.
If you would like to make amendments from the perspective of your voice in the Sector, feel free to provide your feedback directly to us at the same email
address.
We look forward to hearing from you.
Tony Spelman & Sam Sefuiva
Co-Chairs
Community Sector Taskforce
Comment 11.1 19 Aug 2010, 1:22 PM
Great - thanks Iris and Tony & Sam - I think this is a lot stronger and has a better framework than the draft. As I think the Steering Group need our comments by tomorrow I have a couple of very brief thoughts:
- Communities of Aotearoa - I like your acknowledgement that the Tangata Whenua Community & Voluntary Sector is primarily accountable to Communities - but I don't think it works for Communities to be the party with whom this agreement is with
- Accountability - I don't think this is the task for a single organsiation - it probably needs to invovlve both parties, and people from several agencies
Comment 12 16 Aug 2010, 9:31 AM
PURPOSE OF THE DOCUMENT:
The draft document lacks clear and precise definition of the current ills that it aims to rectify or benefits that it that it aims to confer.
The document as it stands bears the flaw of proposing solutions before defining the problems that these solutions will address and/or the benefits that they will bring.
INEQUALITY OF PARTNERSHIP:
Only the Government Partner has the resources to monitor that the partners are conforming with the Agreement.
Even if Community and Voluntary Sector representatives are invited to be involved in the monitoring process it will be at Government expense and this will inevitably more…
Comment 13 24 Aug 2010, 3:02 PM
Comment on the draft Agreement from Volunteering New Zealand
Volunteering New Zealand is an association of volunteer centres, national and other organisations with a commitment to volunteering. These organisations cover emergency services, health, welfare, education, sport and recreation, the arts, faith based organisations, conservation, international aid, special interests and advocacy.
Volunteering New Zealand (VNZ) has major concerns about the draft Agreement.
Its first concern is that the draft as presented will not be able to achieve an effective ongoing relationship between Government and its agencies and the community sector.
We do acknowledge that the draft document provides the starting place or preamble for more…