Proposal for Dogs on Leashes at Bagnall Beach

Further research needs to be done to identify if it is really dogs causing water quality issues. Water quality peaks in previous years which resulted in the closure of the beach were at one stage identified by Council as being caused, not by dogs, but by birds and from fertilisers from gardens in the Bagnall Beach residential area above the beach. Perhaps the education campaign undertaken by Council with residents in that area worked as the readings over the summer period this year were better than the previous 2-3 years. Leave the dogs alone and bring this plan up to date with what is currently happening there.

The management plan is right - dogs should be kept on the leash at Bagnalls and all other beaches. Water quality is the least of it. How many times do I see owners pretending not to notice the mess their dogs leave behind? How often are people intimidated by other people's slobbering dogs. It can be terrifying to come across a large and aggressive dog off the leash,especially for kids (these dogs are usually owned by equally aggressive and unplesant people and are a real danger).

A beach should be for the public and not open to any one group to take over and intimidate others. We do not have a beach for gun owners to walk around with loaded weapons or for litter bugs to drop litter so why on earth would we accommodate dog owners and their excesses the way we do?

Once again another proposal to reduce recreational activities for dogs and their owners-dogs need to be able to run and we have practically no areas that are safe and off lead, DECC have stolen our access at Birubi the only other beach in the whole council area that was leash free. If there were more leash free beaches it would spread the load out- why else do you think every man and his dog is at bagnalls beach!! We are rate payers and pay dog registration we are entitled to fair opportunities for off leash exercise

Prominent signage indicating that Bagnalls is a dog beach may help individuals decided whether it is the most appropriate beach to meet their needs - it is not as if there is a lack of quality beaches in the area, most of which are much more pleasant than Bagnalls (due to the seaweed and stench at low tide). If dogs are to be given free reign of one beach, surely Bagnalls is the most appropriate? If the dogs weren't there, people would complain about the kiteboarders - where does it end? Chose another beach!

On any day you visit this area you will witness many dogs and owners relaxing and enjoying the freedom of unrestrained exercise. As to the problems with water quality the greater majority of owners are responsible with the removal of their dogs business, that is evident by the fact that the supplied disposal points are well used and it is not uncommon to find that the disposal bags have run out and owners will take their own supplies to this area. As for agressive dogs, these owners keep their dogs on there leads as they do not want to jeopardise the welfare or life of their pet. This beach is for everyone to use but how often do you see people swimming there????? Lets get real and ensure that this area is maintained as a off leash exercise area for the benefit of our dogs. The Port Stephens area offers numerous recreational beaches of superior quality to Bagnalls Beach for swimming etc.

As ratepayers, responsible dog owers and regular users of the off-lead dog beach at Bagnall Beach Reserve, we strongly object to any change to the off-lead status of this area. We are aware that recent problems of water quality at Bagnall beach was mainly due to contanination from sources other than dog waste. Even if dog waste is identified to be a major source of contamination, forcing people to walk their dogs on-lead will not address this problem. What is required is improved education and greater enforcement of existing rules. We do not believe the vast majority of responsible dog owners should be punished for the irresponsible actions of a few. In addition, as this is the only accessible off-lead dog exercise area, by changing the current status of the beach, Council is potentially limiting the residential and tourist growth of Port Stephens. Dog owners comprise a substantial percentage of the general population, and the proposed move will make Port Stephens an unattractive place for those with dogs to live or visit.

Dogs,their owners and just plain dog lovers go to Bagnalls for enjoyment, exercise and to interact with each other. We are a Nelson Bay family that enjoy the beach with our dog every single day. Our friends and extended family bring their dogs from across NSW so that they too can enjoy this beach. Its a real draw card for Nelson Bay and a treasure that we never take for granted.

Yes, as dog owners perhaps we all need to be reminded occasionally to pick up after our dogs. There are always a plentiful supply of Poo bags at the beach, so no excuses. But contaminating the sea water...........you've got to be pulling my leash!

Bagnalls Beach is not a swimming beach due to low tide smell and seaweed. It is a great beach for dog walking and meeting up with other dog owners and their dogs! Dog walking is an incentive for dog owners too! "Fido may hold the key to helping Australia’s rising obesity rates. A new Australian study has found that if all dog owners walked their canine buddies, the health benefits would be similar to giving up smoking." Dogs unleashed love to run and I have never seen a dog fight in the 20 years that I have been walking my dogs unleashed in designated parks and beaches. I've never seen a dog poo in the water either!! By the way, where do the boats in the nearby Marinas empty their sewage??? Maybe that should be investigated?

If you dont want to walk where the dogs are exercising, dont go to Bagnalls - there is an overwhelming number of beaches, walkways, picnic areas, parks and National Parks in the area for you!

Also - it would be great if another area was made available for unleashed dog exercise in the Bay - refer to Hawthorne Canal Reserve Canal Rd Leichhardt (Sydney) where hundreds of dogs and their owners spend time exercising, socialising and drinking coffee and puppycinos at "Cafe Bones" - the dogs socialise as much as the people and friendships definitely spring up there. The café is set among two reserves along a canal. There's no main road nearby and there's about a kilometre of off-leash area for the dogs to run around. Great for power walking and keeping humans fit too!!

My dog is a puppy so I am quite new to walking along Bagnalls Beach but I am absolutely hooked on my morning walk and have met so many responsible, caring and friendly people. My pup is a tiny 4 kilos so I felt rather intimidated the first time big dogs ran up to play but right away they were running along together and the owners were walking along chatting with me. One subject seems prominent and that is the idea that Bagnalls Beach will become a ‘dogs-on-lease’ beach which sounds like the first step to becoming a ‘dog-free’ beach.

So all you dog lovers who enjoy the joy of walking barefoot in the sand together with the thrill of seeing your dog playing with other dogs, PLEASE, stand up, speak out and Bang the Table!

I am a frequent dog walker along Bagnalls beach and am starting a petition to oppose the Councils Proposal Of all dogs to be On leashes along Bagnall's beach!

I am also holding a public meeting to obtain help and support for the community in regards to this Issue..

PUBLIC MEETING

10AM SATURDAY 29TH MARCH 2008

OPEN TOILET BLOCK END OF BEACH, BOTTOM OF MISERY HILL

Meeting is to discuss options of what we can do against council to keep Bagnalls beach open as an off leash beach and to get support and helpers with the petition!

Kim!!

P.S I will be back to post details as to where you can sign the petition, I am also going to be sitting at baggies beach so you can sign! Keep a watch out for details...

I love the way all dog users portray themselves as responsible yet there is always faeces on the beach and we are forever reading reports of dogs attacking children.

If people insist on letting their dogs run around off the leash than a fenced area could be provided that can be hosed clean when visited by the rarely spotted 'irresponsible owners' or the responsible ones who just happen to look the other way while Fido is enjoying number 2s.

Bagnalls beach may not be a beachside paradise but why should I be forced to drive to walk away from my local beach just becasue people cannot control their animals? Dont dog owners understand that their dogs are intimidating to many others?

Me again!

I have petitions placed at the following places:

Anna Bay Pharmacy

129 Gan Gan Road,

Anna Bay

49822490

Port Stephens Pet Barn ( In Row of shops next to Mcdonalds)

Shop 6/5 Bagnalls Beach Rd

Salamander Way

49827777

Salamander Bay Veterinary Clinic (Opposite BP service Station)

168 Salamander Way

Salamander Bay

49827492

Noah's Ark Veterinary Clinic (Opposite Taxi rank)

55 Donald Street

Nelson Bay

49811033

Gloria Jeans Coffee Shop

91 Magnus Street

Nelson Bay

49849400

I am hoping to have some more placed and when I do, I will come back and post details as to where!

I generally agree with the recommendations in the draft Management Plan, but I'm more concerned about the other beaches in Port Stephens. If Bagnalls Beach is meant to be the 'dog off leash' beach then why do we constantly see dogs running free at every other beach as well? Soldiers Point, Wanda, Salamander, Birubi ... they are all clearly marked as either 'on leash' or 'no dogs allowed.' I guess all the responsible dog owners are at Bagnalls!

Bagnall's Beach was one of the catalysts for us when we were considering a place to retire.On our first visit to the beach we were overwhelmed by the friendly greetings we received from people walking their dogs and the positive interaction between dogs of all sizes and breeds!This "dog of the leash beach" is the best thing the Port Stephens Council has ever provided in terms of a community venue; it

beats community halls, parks,sports grounds etc. and the beach itself costs the council almost nothing to maintain;no painting, no electricty bills etc.

This appears to be typical knee jerk reactive bureaucracy, whereby, Gov't applies pointless rules and impliments useless laws without scientific fact. All responsible people want to preserve the environment. We in Port Stephens have a unique water wonderland. I use Bagnalls Beach on a daily basis, as do hundreds of other residents and visitors. Yes, there are a few irresponsible pet owners who do not clean up after their pet/s. Those are the same people who will not clean up after their pet, whether it is on a leash or not. They are not restricted to Bagnalls Beach, they are community wide.

If Council is serious about having a pristine waterway, perhaps they should broaden their attention to incorporate effluent eminating from the numerous marinas, professional and recreational fishing activities, Council managed storm water drains, hosing out of garbage bins on the streets of the CBD of Nelson Bay, the run-off from the hundreds of farms and faeces from the tens of thousands of animals on those farms, the recreational boating community. These are the major contamination sources of our waterway.

Bagnalls Beach provides a venue for unique social interaction for both humans and their pets. Fortunately, there is still room in Port Stephens for both dog lovers and others, so leave the Bagnalls user's in peace!

I am a dog owner and walk my dogs at Bagnall Beach every day. It is certainly the highlight of my day seeing my dogs having a great time running, playing & swimming with other dogs and chatting with the friendly locals and tourists. Comments such as "there is always faeces on the beach and we are forever reading reports of dogs attacking children" is completely untrue. The majority of dog owners who walk at Bagnalls are responsible and do pick up their dog droppings. Those who walk their dogs at Bagnalls are also generally people who have well behaved & well socialised dogs who are under their effective control. I am yet to encounter an aggressive dog at Bagnalls (although this is not the issue as outlined in the draft plan). I am in agreement with many others that dog droppings isn't the major cause of water quality issues. Previous reports have sighted the most likely cause as a combination of bird droppings, fertilisers, storm water drains & run-off from properties on Sandy Point/Government Road.

I also wonder whether the real reason behind the 'Dog Leash proposal' is as per the management plan at 8.7 Dog Exercise Areas - "Dog Exercise Areas, both on-leash and off-leash are common in foreshore reserves. The following issues have been identified with regard to these areas:"the more intensive use of Kooindah Park, Lemon Tree Passage and Bagnalls Beach Reserve for passive recreation (a strategy recommended to take pressure off Shoal Bayand Little Beach) is not consistent with an off-leash dog exercise area". I very much doubt that locals or tourists would prefer a day at Bagnalls if they have the choice of Shoal Bay or Little Beach! There are 20+ other beached to choose from in Port Stephens.

In response to the comment "Im curious to know just how is banning dogs off there leash going to adversly effect tourism or people relocating here ?" My dogs are part of the family and having access to an off-leash beach we could enjoy as a family, was an important factor we took into consideration when deciding whether or not to relocate to Port Stephens. As far as tourists go, those who regularly walk at Bagnalls will know just how many families holiday here with their dogs because they see Port Stephens as being 'dog friendly'. In fact, we met a lovely family (including their dog) from Sydney at Bagnalls over the Easter break, who asked us about Council's proposal and said that they enjoy visiting Port Stephens, but would have changed their holiday destination this time if they were unable to bring their dog. I hope Council listens to the voice of the majority and retains Bagnalls as the one beach in Port Stephens that dogs and their owners can continue to enjoy.

We too walk our dogs at Bagnalls beach, one of the reasons we bought our place is due to having the most wonderful leash free beach in NSW. When we are visting Port Stephens, we spend hours everyday on Baggies, enjoying other people's dogs as well as the comradery of the fellow dog walkers. We have made many wonderful friendships on the beach and would be bitterly disappointed if we were to loose it. Picking up is not a problem due to the council supplying bags, and I dont see why we should be punished for doing the right thing when a small amount of people do not. Maybe the rangers need to be on the beach more often during the peak seasons and issuing fines to those who do not pick up after their dogs. Better signage would be a benefit for the beach to, so that people know when they enter onto the beach, they are sharing it with dogs.

Just wanting ot update the list on places petitions are out and about...

Harbourside Haven Retirement Villages

89 Shoal Bay Rd,

Shoal Bay

49841811

Williamtown Raaf Base

Williamtown

Penninsula Cakes & Pies (only 24hr Bakery in Port Stephens)

129 Gan Gan Rd

Anna Bay

49849400

DONT FORGET ABOUT THE MEETING TOMORROW AT BAGGIES BEACH, 10am...SEE YOU THERE!!

Having been a resident of Port Stephens for 35 years I have seen this council and previous councils destroy the natural beauty of the area. They have their own planning committee which often suggests they not allow certain developments, which they then totally disregard. All of our water problems, sand erosion and pollution issues started when the Nelson Bay Breakwall and Marina were built. I am totally against the proposed redevelopment of the foreshore from Corlette to Shoal Bay. Yet again another development aimed at not the locals that live here and support the town all year round but at the tourist. We like our beaches just the way they are. We do not want boardwalks and shops all along our waterfront, this will only add to the pollution of our waterways. A comment from the State government was "it's nice to have green space but people need somewhere to go", people come to the area beacause of its natural beauty, they don't come to see a concrete jungle. As for Bagnalls Beach, having dogs running off-leash does not fit the councils agenda, there are plenty of suitable swimming beaches in the area. There is no need to take our beach from us. How about the council gets more concerned with doing whats right for the people that live here as opposed to the transient tourist, who seem to be the worst offenders when it comes to cleaning up after themselves. We are the rate payer and it is about time that our voice was taken as seriously as that of the tourist

After the Bagnalls Beach Action Group meeting at the beach this morning it was noted that if we want to save our Dogs-Off-Leash Beach it is necessary for us to write INDIVIDUAL letters to the

Environmental Service Manager

Port Stephens Council

PO Box 42

Raymond Terrace

NSW 2324

Make your opinion count.

It was great to see so much support on Saturday at Bagnalls Beach for the Dogs Off lead Action group.Plenty of people and our canine friends attended.There was a huge amount of ideas and input about what should be actively done.Thankyou to Kim,who has joined the group and will continue to distribute the petition she has made up, and will send them all to council.I have made up a newsletter and will get them out to as many people possible.The group is also going to distribute individual letters to people to sign and they will be delivered to the Council.The Media is also inolved and will be kept updated.The local radio station F.M.100.9 will give us all an udate every Tuesday at 1400hrs.

The next public meeting is on Saturday 12th April at the Bagnalls Beach end car park,at the bottom of Misery Hill.In case it is rotten weather it will be held at 11 Pantowora St, Corlette.0249811086.

We are also encouraging people to go to New Residents Lobby group at the Nelson Bay Bowling Club at 1930hrs on Monday 31st March.The discussion is about the development of the Port Stephens and Nelson bay foreshore,with guest speaker Keith Southall from the Department of lands.The group is called The Tomaree Ratepayers and Residents Association.

I think that is all at the moment.

P.S. If you don't get a blank letter a nd envelope please write to council about our issue

Mr Bruce Peterson,

Environmental Service Manager,

Port Stephens Council,

P.O.Box 42

Raymond Terrace.N.S.W. 2334

See you all on the 12th Goodluck and Thanks

P.P.S. I gave the wrong postcode, it is 2324 not 2334

Bye And Woof Woof fom my babies

When we holidayed in Nelson Bay for 6 years it was because of Bagnall's Beach and the fact that it was a leash free beach. When we eventually decided to move here permanently 6 years ago, it was opposite Bagnall's Beach to allow us to continue the freedom we had come to enjoy with our large dog. It is because of this beach and the wonderful exercise our dog enjoys, that she is still with us today. The fact that she is able to swim everyday, enencumbered, has helped with her arthritis and enabled her to live a long and happy life on this beach. The health benefits that so many dogs gain, both young and old, by swimming freely are enormous. It would be a real tragedy to take this freedom away from our canine friends. Why should the irresponsibility of a few and their actions determine the fate of so many lovely dog owners who respect and apprectiate this wonderful beach and the opportunity it provides for all of us, both residents and visitors? I propose more prominent signs warning non dog lovers that it is a "lead-free" beach might help in their choice of a place to swim.

20, 10 years ago the sea life on the beach and sea weed area was so full of life it was great!!! i wonder why there is nothing there at all now?

Im guessing the dog lovers would disagree and its obviously nothing to with dogs jumping on them, eating them, digging them up, and generally disturbing the native and natural eco system!! get a life, go to a dog park and chase a ball.. GET OFF THE BEACH

Not to even mention the fact that i cant walk along the beach with my kids without getting dogs running up to us not sure if we are going to get bitten or slurped or generally harassed or step in what is left over from there backsides.

FYI i have a dog, have been at Corlette since 1975, and have lost 2 dogs since i've been here, i don't take them on the beach, why, because i RESPECT, UNDERSTAND and realize ITS NOT THE PLACE FOR HER. This just sounds like bored women wanting something to do for the sake of it.

Removed by moderator. Comment was deemed offensive, inappropriate or spam.

Hi all, local kitesurfer here, In last weeks Port Stephens Examiner a certain someone labelled the possibility of bike riders, or kitesurfers behind the proposed change, what a load of absolute crap! we have had nothing to do with this change, and if you have any issues it should be taken up with Councillor Sally Dover who will inform you of the purposes behind the change.

Bagnalls beach is also not the only off lead dog beach see below, http://www.portstephens.nsw.gov.au/community/1019/1034.html

We are more than happy to coexist with dog owners, 90% of you are great and chat to us and we have a semi good relationship, however, some of the long term baggies dog owners believe that they own the beach and have no control over their dogs and are responsible for several attacks on not only us but children.

This is only a MINOR FEW, and it is only these minor few long term locals that do not pick up after their dogs, and laugh when their dogs bite others.

I stated all this because if you read the fine print on the website, it actually says that as long as your dog is under/and can be controlled it can be off the leash, if not it has to be on the leash. Most dogs are great on the beach but again it is just the minor few that spoil it for the rest, I have been attacked three times, all within 20 meters of the owner, who stood there and laughed, and then said "i cant control my dog", she then later contradicted her statement in saying she "could control her dog" after she found that her annoying dog had only grazed the back of my leg and not taken a chunk out of it.. this is not acceptable, and can be grounds to have the dog put down,

However we as a kitesurfing group we want to coexist on baggies sharing equally and so did not pursue the matter, and hope that if we have offended you in any way, i want to take this oppurtunity to apologise.

Also think about this, are we kitesurfers still kiting there even though it is said to be polluted? the answer... yes.. So with that said,

I want to make it absolutley clear we have no problem with any dog owners say about two to five owners out of all the hundreds that visit the beach, your dogs are under control, and you pick up after them (except the minor few long term locals about 5 all up, who never pick up after their dog, and chat with each other whilst their dogs are out of control and trying to attack others.)

Generally we think that you are all great bunch of people and hope we can coexist on baggies. Good luck with your petition... where can we sign one.. On behalf of a attacked but forgiving kitesurfer in support of leaving controlled dogs off leashes on baggies beach

I as a dog owner of 2 that lets them run off the lead at Baggies beach I would like to thank for your response.I would also like to point out the it is a beach that is meant to coexist with dog and human and sometimes our dogs get goaded by some of you.One of the most frustrating thing to me is when I have to walk a fair way away from you guys because there is nowhere else to walk on the beach because it is full of your kites etc.It is not completely your beach and I think you have you be mindful that we are sharing the beach and if our dogs get a bit agro,just like you,it is completely understandable.But just be mindful, it is a leash free dog beach.I know that every dog owner understands the consequences of a dog bite or attack,but how do think the dog owner feels when the dog is been hit by a stick or being kicked, or because they are walking over your kites and strings.Thankyou for signing the petition,but give us a fair go.We have just as much right on the beach as you guys.If you are worried about the kids,don't bring them with you.

Gezza, mate, we are not the ones that think we own the beach, nor have we ever hit dog, read the fine lines of my last post, it is a off leash dog beach, as long as your dog IS UNDER CONTROL OFF LEASH! we are more than willing and have always been able to share the beach happily. It is council property, not ours, and instead of fueding and playing the blame game, lets work together to preserve what we like to use the beach for. and in future come and talk to us about moving our kites.. unsaid fustrations can never be addressed, and remember not one of our kiters have ever hit a dog. not even when we have been bitten. remember when we are trying to control a kite, and a dog is trying to attack us we take it seriously because people can get seriously injured if we loose control of the kite and it hits someone. so please do not address your posts as saying that you think we own the beach... it is not ours, its not yours, its all of ours, and we need to learn to share it properly and come together on these issues working together to see that the beach is available for all. about your post. About the kids, they have more of a right to be on the beach than your dog, and if they attack kids, they should be put down end of story, most dogs 99.9% of them are usually just overplayful, but the few (you know who you are) have vicous dogs, and encourage then laugh when they attack us, and kids, not even any of our kids, other dog owners kids, and port stephens visitors kids in fact. so remember the council is looking at these posts, and now i wonder after your comments and my reply what they think of you? remember council will like unity.! because remember its Port Stephens' beach not ours! - and dont rephrase my comments against me, i am not attacking you, just trying to get you to see that we are all facing a problem, after all if you get banned will we kiters not be next>?

Removed by moderator. Comment was deemed offensive, inappropriate or spam.

MESSAGE FROM ADMIN

Just a polite reminder to users that this is a consultation on Council's Foreshore Management Plan. There has been a fantastic discussion here which has resulted in Council responding directly to the community on this issue (see the statement above posted on 4 April).

This is not an ongoing chat site for dog walkers and other beach users to discuss relative rights. This is for input to Council's foreshore plan. Please ensure that your comments address that issue. We will be moderating irrelevant comments.

At least there are no time resitictions at Bagnalls Beach to walk your dogs. In Anna Bay the signs say we can have dogs on the beach betweeen certain times.....these times don't change with daylight saving so often if we want to walk the dog on the beach it has to be in the dark!!!